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[COCHISE]

I seem to have a problem I have not experienced before in hundreds of imprints with JPSS.

The design is "text only" on 8 x 11" JPSS (purchased fresh in early May) imprinted with an Epson WF1100 and MSI heat transfer ink via a Mighty Press at heavy pressure, 380 degrees for 35 seconds. I printed on Anvil 100% pre-shrunk white shirts. I peeled hot, with, to my eye, 100% of ink transfer to the shirt. I did NOT, nor have I ever, repressed with parchment, Teflon or anything else.

This series of shirts would have been about the 550 or 600th imprint for ALL the aforementioned setup. The only difference was that it was text and each design was a different color ink.... red, blue and black.

The client reports that after one washing the ink in every test shirt had faded significantly, near 50%.  She indicated she had followed washing instructions for printed garments.

Allowing for common sense to prevail, the ONLY physical things that are different from the previous batches are the actual paper and shirts.

Speaking with the supplier of the paper yielded no help. They offered a few thoughts but nothing concrete.

Does anyone have any thoughts??

Ken

[MXRacingDad]

Only had this happen to one shirt, a gildan 2000 and only one time. Still don't know why.

[MonkeyMeMe]

Ken,
Do you have one of those tees and a different one on hand,,

Press em both, wash the heck out of em,, if both fade , it was the paper.

If one shirt does better than the other than it is the tees...

if it is the paper,, send the pics to the dist,, so they can see , the problem.

Wish i could help more,,

MMM

[COCHISE]

That will be my next test........... as soon as I stabilize.

Thank you and Bill for your thoughts.


ken

[deChez]

I'll be interested to see how your tests come out. I use JPSS alot, and while I have been having some problems with the paper lately, I've been chalking it up to the fact that my house is so cold and damp during the winter.

Hope you figure out what it is....that's got to be frustrating for you to have a problem with something that you've used so many times before.

[badablue]

Did you see the shirts or is this your clients opinion? Now that we have Vanessa on board from neenah papers you might want to address this problem with her.

[badablue]

Did you see the shirts or is this your clients opinion? Now that we have Vanessa on board from neenah papers you might want to address this problem with her.vanessa.ruiz@neenahpaper.com

[MonkeyMeMe]

Lou,, I totally agree , vanessa can maybe help us,
We are so lucky to have her here,,
MMM

[COCHISE]

The client is mailing back the washed shirts and a couple of unwashed for comparison.

I will contact Vanessa and reference this forum topic.

IMHO, the only two variables are SIZING or some treatment on the shirt or the paper being in some way defective, HOWEVER I am leaning toward some sizing or contaminate in the shirt.

I am awaiting further input from the client.

Ken

[MonkeyMeMe]

Ken sorry you have to go thru this, but i think you are right,,
about the 2 options,,
MMM

[COCHISE]

I have not received the washed and unwashed examples back from the client yet BUT I have made one more interesting observation.

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN Pro World #401 and JPSS on NATURAL CANVAS TOTES.

I WOULD CALL IT NIGHT AND DAY. By that I mean the polymer shadow with JPSS is 1 full shade darker than the totes natural color. The #410 has no polymer shadow at all. I tried to take some photos of the two totes side by side but the difference is hard to see with this camera. Click on the photo and look at the lower left side of it. Follow across the entire photo and see the darker JPSS vs the #401

Which begs the question........ why the hell am I using JPSS at all??




Did I mention there was ZERO "hand" with the #401...........

I saw the "other names" for the Clear Soft 401 and the manufacturer someplace but I can't find that info..... anybody have it handy??

ken :'(

[MonkeyMeMe]

I agree with you  ken,,

401 looks alot better,,,

[American logoZ]

When I compared JPSS & 401 on the bar coasters, my results with the polymer shadow were identical to yours.  I will say, however, that the 401 print was less precise (smudgy smeary looking) though it did not further smear after being printed & pressed, even when subjected to water.

Is this the manufacturer's link you're looking for...http://www.hyattis.com/front/distributors.aspx

[COCHISE]

That is the link, Thank you.

The imprint on the tote was only black ink but it was in perfect register, no hand, sharp and crisp..

I will order a sample pack and do more testing of the Clear Soft or whatever they want to call it.

I suspect I just had a bad batch of JPSS. That notwithstanding, and a $300 refund and loss of reputation, the lack of polymer shadow allows it to be used on pastel and heather without the "box". If tests confirm that I suspect we will understand Ed fro Pro World's comment about a large ratio of Clear Soft reorder vs JPSS.

ken

[gprockhill]

Am I correct that the totes being used are 'natural' in color? Those from Coastal Business?

[COCHISE]

The totes used were from Cheap Totes and were a "natural" color. The Coastal totes are similar in composition and are the natural color..

ken

[deChez]

I believe it's the fabric rather than the color -- something in the production process, not the fabric cotton. My experience has been that the polymer shadow shows up quite strongly on unbleached cotton muslin, or an unbleached cotton woven fabric, but not on a natural color cotton Gildan tee. I have noticed this with JPSS, and also when I used to use Ironall (before discovering JPSS).

I've not tried this Clear Soft 401 that you speak of. Is it for inkjet?

Also, I have never had JPSS fade. I use my HP printer and regular tri-color inks....have even bleached shirts with no fading.

[gprockhill]

I know that the original issue has to do with T's but with regard to totes, I have had a heck of a time with totes in general. The only ones I currently trust are those from Coastal Business.

[COCHISE]

The following is NOT a JPSS bash. It is a statement of documented facts based on testing conducted by me in the most logical and controlled environment I could create.


The answer to the issue is that on a 95% probability, I received a bad package of 8 x 11 paper. I tested a sample taken from a roll of JPSS and a sample taken from the package of 8 x 11. Same graphic, same printer, same ink, same heat press, same temp, same dwell, same operator, same tee shirt from the exact same batch that faded, cut in half and identified with a magic marker. Washed both halves in the same washing machine at the same time. The results?? The JPSS sample taken from the roll showed very minor fading, well within acceptable limits. The sample from the 8 x 11 package showed, by my eye, a 15 to 20% fade. End of story. Stuff happens.

The JPSS has a characteristic grainy/sandpaper feel. When I first switched to this paper, the washing tests originally yielded good results on spot samples taken from amongst the many hundreds of Gildan 5000 shirts printed. The poly shadow faded and the feel of the shirt softened. Repressing with silicone parchment paper created a softer feel but removed some ink from the fibers. I opted not to repress.

 I was happy having a reliable paper to print my white Tees with. I buy it by the 13" x 100' roll, by the 8 x 11 package and by the 11 x 17 package.

I received some Clearsoft from Pro World. It is also marketed under Everlast, Elisti-jet, Jetflex and others.

I created 125 totes with the JPSS on unbleached cotton totes purchased from Cheap Totes. Not a single misprint due to sizing or other contaminates in the fabric. The darkened border from the un-inked paper edge was evident, but it did not matter as the theme of the imprint was in sepia. I printed 75 more totes, full color graphic, same paper, same tote, same ugly dark border....

I decided to print a couple more with the Clearsoft sample paper. No shadow, no grainy feel, no ugly border.

I can't afford to have multiple brands of paper to print the different types of fabric I currently imprint. If the shadow is not present when imprinting totes I intend to market in my store that have been created by a process that is somewhat "green", that is the paper I will most likely use for all my imprinting.

Further testing will be conducted on pastel, Ash and Heather colored shirts..

ken

[deChez]

So I'm hearing from this conversation that the ClearSoft or ProWorld 401 leaves less window, and has a softer hand.

I have some totes to do for a customer out of unbleached cotton, and the JPSS leaves quite a window on that. I'm thinking I'd like to give the 401 a shot, but I'm confused about the blurry aspect. Is the 401 more or less blurry?